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List 1b Tyres - again

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Wed Aug 05, 2015 8:39 am PostPost subject: List 1b Tyres - again
HummuH
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So, bit of a shake-up next year on this.

As I understand it, Yoko A048, Kumho V70 and R888 are losing their "E" marking due to new EU regs coming into play. This may affect other Tyres such as Direzza too, not sure.

As far as I'm aware, new Toyo R888R is only "track" tyre that will pass the new EU regs in time for next year. Yoko aren't bringing the A050 over here as that will also not get "E" approval.

So, Yoko, Kumho and possibly Dunlop may have to develop new tyres to get in 1b next year.

How's this one gonna pan out? Anyone got any knowledge about this?
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Wed Aug 05, 2015 8:55 am PostPost subject: Re: List 1b Tyres - again
AK
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TOYO Tyres wrote:
Toyo Tires Dispels “Track Day Tyre Myths”

In the current climate of uncertainty that surrounds the important ‘track day’ semi-slick tyre market, Japanese manufacturer Toyo Tires has endeavoured to add a little clarity to proceedings with an unequivocal statement regarding the ongoing road legality of both its Proxes R888 and R888R products in the UK. Put simply, both products can continue be used on the highway with impunity!

The need to clarify this position comes in the wake of confusion from both end-users and retailers alike regarding the legislational changes governing semi-slick tyres. Following significant changes put into place in the UK on 1st November 2014, many so-called ‘track day’ tyres - which offer greater grip thanks to their semi-slick design – were effectively outlawed for road use. Conforming to all the new labelling requirements however, the Proxes R888 and R888R were granted full ‘E’ mark status, making them totally acceptable for British highway use and eligible to pass an MOT, subject to the usual minimum tread depth requirements.

It is widely believed that some of the confusion in motorsport circles may have arisen from the sport’s governing body, the MSA having previously earmarked the R888/R888R pairing as due for future removal from the all-important ‘List 1b’ – which denotes road legal tyres approved for competition use. As the backbone of many British Club Championships, this approval is vital. However, having noted both tyre’s conformity to the new road legislation, the MSA has since announced that it will be reinstating the tyres ‘Ib’ status in the next issue of the sport’s handbook – the ‘Blue Book’.

Commenting on this unusual situation. Toyo UK’s Motorsport and Technical Director Alan Meaker said, “It’s clear to many tyre companies that there is a huge amount of confusion in this important market. Therefore, it is important for us to put some facts back into the marketplace to reassure both retailers and end-users alike. They are, that along with a handful of other quality designs, the Toyo Proxes R888 and R888R will retain their E-marking, full road legality and MSA Blue Book eligibility. From our point of view, and thanks to the quality of our design, the new legislation hasn’t changed a thing. It’s important for consumers to check what they are buying though – as not all brands and products have been able to conform as we have. Certain other tyres, if produced after the 2014 cut-off date, may be illegal to use on the highway, or for club competition.”

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Wed Aug 05, 2015 8:59 am PostPost subject:
HummuH
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So Toyo are covered, but what about other manufacturers?
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Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:02 am PostPost subject:
David Long
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Kumho seem to have revised their compounds. I guessing for this reason. The super soft compound K11 is no longer and has been replaced with K12 which is a little harder but probably just enough to get an E mark status.
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Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:06 am PostPost subject:
HummuH
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David Long wrote:
Kumho seem to have revised their compounds. I guessing for this reason. The super soft compound K11 is no longer and has been replaced with K12 which is a little harder but probably just enough to get an E mark status.


I was told specifically that the current Kumho V70/V700 will not get the new "E" mark as legislation stands, think it's more down to tread depth and pattern (i.e. ability to deal with water on the road) rather than compound.

This worries me as they are by far and away my favourite tyre which is why I was asking.
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Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:16 am PostPost subject:
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Thread running over as Pistonheads: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=1531409
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Wed Aug 12, 2015 2:31 pm PostPost subject:
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so for the Caterham series down south they are swapping to yoko A050 i believe next year but interestingly they dont appear on the UK yoko site.
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Wed Aug 12, 2015 2:57 pm PostPost subject:
HummuH
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andybell wrote:
so for the Caterham series down south they are swapping to yoko A050 i believe next year but interestingly they dont appear on the UK yoko site.


Strange, I have been told by Yoko that they aren't bringing the A050 over here as it also fails the "E" mark test.

I wonder if it will go on to the mythical "List 1C" which seems to be where most of the current 1B crop will end up. Will the Championship regulations include List 1C or stick to 1B? Going to be interesting.

I wish someone would clarify this. Kumho are a joke at the moment, can't get V70's in a suitable size for love nor money. Should have done what David did and stock up at start of season.

Nothing new here, but from MSA Blue Book:

For 2016 there will be a Tyre List 1C. This will be solely for Competition Tyres complying with EEC Regulation 30 and intended exclusively for racing. Some of the tyres included in the current Tyre List 1B will move to the new Tyre List 1C.
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Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:11 pm PostPost subject:
andybell
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trying to find out if this is still the case. be interesting next year if only 1 type of tyre can be used Smile
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Wed Aug 12, 2015 6:02 pm PostPost subject:
andybell
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its not the case now for that series - apparently they are sticking the A048 next year.
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Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:47 pm PostPost subject:
HummuH
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Found some chat from Kumho on Lotus 7 forum

Quote:
The V70A does not comply with the latest EU labelling legislation, which was introduced in November 2014. The ‘Soft’ options do not meet the EU ‘rolling resistance’ requirements.

Kumho tyres can continue to sell these tyres that do not meet this new legislation with the old ‘E Marking’ for a maximum of 30 months. Kumho, along with most other tyre manufacturers of track day tyres, is exercising the use of a clause which allows tyre companies to continue to manufacture and sell tyres which do not comply with the legislation by stating that they are "designed for racing purposes”.

Kumho have no plans to stop production of the V70A. Any plan to replace the V70A would be ‘medium to long term’. Kumho suggest ‘these changes mean that most Championships, which in the past have run the V70A, Proxes, R888 etc., will have to change their regulations to allow List 1C tyres for 2016’.

All currently e-marked V70A tyres will continue to be road legal for the life of the tyre.


So, my take on it is that most circuit racing Championships that are currently "List 1B" will simply move to "List 1B or List 1C", problem solved?

Where it looks as if it will have the biggest impact is where there are "road going" classes, such as SLS, Sprinting or Hillclimbing as List 1C tyres will not be permissible as designated "for racing use only".
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Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:08 pm PostPost subject:
Merlin
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What is it that they are changing about the tyre EU regulations? All I have found so far is a new noise classification?
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Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:22 pm PostPost subject:
HummuH
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Merlin wrote:
What is it that they are changing about the tyre EU regulations? All I have found so far is a new noise classification?


Yep, that's basically it, a lot of the 1B tyres will fail on noise levels and lose their "E" marking.
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