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Newbie from Glasgow - also need some advice.

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Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:15 pm PostPost subject: Newbie from Glasgow - also need some advice.
Paul Jay
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Hi, I'm Paul, recently moved to Glasgow.

I'm after a bit of advice regarding the class my car would sit in, it was built with sprint/hillclimb in mind, but I ended up going drag racing!

It's a MK1 Golf, running a forged/hybrid turbo'd 20vt, water/meth, LSD etc 350(ish) whp and (guess) 850 kg with me in it

Full multipoint cage, composite everything apart from the shell.

I can bolt the steel panels back on but will the motor stick me in Sports Libre?

I've got a Nat B non race license.

Can I compete competitively? Or is it worth de tuning it a bit?

Cheers
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Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:19 pm PostPost subject:
Paul Jay
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Apologies!

Didn't read the new user bit :/
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Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:47 pm PostPost subject:
AK
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Hello and welcome Smile

I guess the competitive part depends on the driver Very Happy

The power to weight figures you posted would put you in A. I'd expect A to be into 53s laps on road legal tyres this year.

B into 54s I think

The engine would mean libre, but its less complicated this year, and a nat B non race would be fine.
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Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:59 pm PostPost subject:
Paul Jay
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Hello Smile

What does A & B mean? And the 53/54? Sorry for the noob questions!

I'll sacrifice being competitive (for now Smile) just to get back out behind the wheel

Or should I post this sort of stuff in a different bit of the forum?
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 6:48 am PostPost subject:
AK
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Class....

What series are you talking about?
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 9:05 am PostPost subject:
Paul Jay
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AK wrote:
Class....

What series are you talking about?


Sorry, should have said, Super Lap Scotland
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 9:46 am PostPost subject:
HummuH
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Hello and welcome.

Very similar spec to Ali Mowat's Mk1 although Ali was running less power I think. Ali was doing low to mid 55's on slicks iirc.

350 whp would be c. 450 bhp engine/fly power I'd imagine. Would love to know how you're getting the power down with that set-up. We originally had the Corrado running about 440 bhp but had to drop it back to c. 370 bhp (290 WHP) to keep it driveable. Laptimes were much quicker when we dropped the power down too.

Would certainly be rapid. Is water/meth allowed outside Pro? Not sure it is.
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 10:00 am PostPost subject:
andybell
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love love love that avatar
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 10:48 am PostPost subject:
Paul Jay
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HummuH wrote:
Hello and welcome.

Very similar spec to Ali Mowat's Mk1 although Ali was running less power I think. Ali was doing low to mid 55's on slicks iirc.

350 whp would be c. 450 bhp engine/fly power I'd imagine. Would love to know how you're getting the power down with that set-up. We originally had the Corrado running about 440 bhp but had to drop it back to c. 370 bhp (290 WHP) to keep it driveable. Laptimes were much quicker when we dropped the power down too.

Would certainly be rapid. Is water/meth allowed outside Pro? Not sure it is.


Ali Mowat? White MK1 Golf? I think I've seen a video of his on You Tube, looked v. quick Smile

I'm not sure how the power is going to do down, I'm still building the engine, it was 250bhp ish before and that was a bit of a handful, that said I think the losses across an 02J are some where in the region of 8-12% so probably closer to 400 crank

I'm not sure about water meth in sports libre, doesn't matter if not, i can either not use it or just use demin water
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 11:58 am PostPost subject:
HummuH
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Paul Jay wrote:
Ali Mowat? White MK1 Golf? I think I've seen a video of his on You Tube, looked v. quick Smile

I'm not sure how the power is going to do down, I'm still building the engine, it was 250bhp ish before and that was a bit of a handful, that said I think the losses across an 02J are some where in the region of 8-12% so probably closer to 400 crank

I'm not sure about water meth in sports libre, doesn't matter if not, i can either not use it or just use demin water


Yep, that's the one. Quick wee car. Ask Ali about traction.

If you're building the engine for laptimes/racing, I'd focus on getting the 1.8T to rev and hold the torque throughout the rev range, that's when they become really potent on track. Turbo is very important in that respect and you can ruin a 1.8 20vT powered car by chasing big power headline figures, which they are easily capable of.

You don't need water/meth to reach that sort of power and you don't need it for cooling either.

What sort of differential are you running (or planning to run)?

I love an old 20vT powered VAG btw, been there and done it myself. Personally, in a Mk1, I'd be focusing on lower power and figuring out how you'll get the front end to behave.
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 3:02 pm PostPost subject:
Paul Jay
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HummuH wrote:
Paul Jay wrote:
Ali Mowat? White MK1 Golf? I think I've seen a video of his on You Tube, looked v. quick Smile

I'm not sure how the power is going to do down, I'm still building the engine, it was 250bhp ish before and that was a bit of a handful, that said I think the losses across an 02J are some where in the region of 8-12% so probably closer to 400 crank

I'm not sure about water meth in sports libre, doesn't matter if not, i can either not use it or just use demin water


Yep, that's the one. Quick wee car. Ask Ali about traction.

If you're building the engine for laptimes/racing, I'd focus on getting the 1.8T to rev and hold the torque throughout the rev range, that's when they become really potent on track. Turbo is very important in that respect and you can ruin a 1.8 20vT powered car by chasing big power headline figures, which they are easily capable of.

You don't need water/meth to reach that sort of power and you don't need it for cooling either.

What sort of differential are you running (or planning to run)?

I love an old 20vT powered VAG btw, been there and done it myself. Personally, in a Mk1, I'd be focusing on lower power and figuring out how you'll get the front end to behave.


Thats some good advice, I'd always planned some 'drivability'

I can have different switchable maps, so it should have a fair bit of flexibility

I've got a quaife ATB, which made a big difference on the old motor.
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 5:26 pm PostPost subject:
AK
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SLS Classes... based on WHEEL hp and Weight inc driver.

Pro: > 450 bhp per tonne
A: 351 - 450 bhp per tonne
B: 271 - 350 bhp per tonne
C: 211 - 270bhp per tonne
D: 161 - 210 bhp per tonne
E: 135 - 160 bhp per tonne
F: < 135 bhp per tonne
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Thu Apr 14, 2016 8:34 pm PostPost subject:
Paul Jay
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AK wrote:
SLS Classes... based on WHEEL hp and Weight inc driver.

Pro: > 450 bhp per tonne
A: 351 - 450 bhp per tonne
B: 271 - 350 bhp per tonne
C: 211 - 270bhp per tonne
D: 161 - 210 bhp per tonne
E: 135 - 160 bhp per tonne
F: < 135 bhp per tonne


That's spot on, A or B for me then, dependant on mapping
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Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:41 am PostPost subject:
HummuH
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Paul Jay wrote:
Thats some good advice, I'd always planned some 'drivability'

I can have different switchable maps, so it should have a fair bit of flexibility

I've got a quaife ATB, which made a big difference on the old motor.


See how you get on with the ATB. I found that torque biasing diffs, like the Peloquin and ATB didn't really work that well with big power.

They are great at getting power down in a straight line but not so good when trying to apply power during cornering and as a result tend to induce a more "point and squirt" driving style.

I found that a clutch/plate type diff with adjusted ramping to suit works best on track. It allows application of more throttle through the corner and will pull you towards the apex rather than spit you away from it. Only downside is they need regular servicing to work at their optimum.
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Fri Apr 15, 2016 8:02 am PostPost subject:
AK
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aye, from my experience KH is too bumpy for torque bias diffs.

as soon as driven wheel lifts all the power spins away like an open diff.

Plate diff is the way to go.
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